TG Daily - = UPDATE: Cat-7 copper theorized to transmit 100 Gbps in excess of 100 = meters using future modems

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UPDATE: Cat-7 = copper=20 theorized to transmit 100 Gbps in excess of 100 meters = using=20 future modems

Trendwatch

By Rick C. Hodgin =

Wednesday, November=20 14, 2007 11:22

Recommend = article:

Pittsburgh = (PA) -=20 Penn State University professor of electrical = engineering,=20 Mohsen Kavehrad, has been researching the possibility = of=20 transmitting extremely high speed data over = copper. He's=20 looking at 100 Gigabits per second on Category-7 wire = at=20 distances in excess of 100 meters. Imagine a = home or=20 office network using inexpensive copper, one that = could=20 transmit over twelve complete Encyclopedia Britannicas = per=20 second.

While 70 meters is possible = today,=20 it's that last 30 meters which is just outside = the reach=20 of theoretical modern technology. Future modems, = which=20 are not the boxes we think of, but are the equivalent = of=20 on-board chips modulating and = demodulating the=20 high speed signals, will be required before practical=20 applications can be built which push copper so=20 far.

Today, the theoretical limitations are = with the=20 65nm process technology. The internal=20 semiconductor-based hardware mechanisms which drive = signals=20 over Cat-7 wire, which is basically a four = twisted-pair heavy=20 gauge wire with extra insulation, cannot work beyond = 70=20 meters. The limitations imposed by degradation, = noise,=20 data races per bit line, bounce, cross-over, and other = factors, all conspire against the existing = technology. =20 These result in limitations in just how fast an = amplified data=20 signal can be switched off and on with minimal digital = waveform loss.

The research team is currently=20 identifying the requirements to create an entirely new = class=20 of modems. They're looking at what designs will = be=20 required to communicate beyond the 70 meter = barrier. =20 They're actually hoping to exceed 100 meters with = their=20 design. While the researchers conclude that this = technology is not even theoretically possible today = with 65nm=20 technology, even under idea circumstances, it is = believed that=20 at the 32nm node, or possibly the 22nm node, it will = be=20 possible. Those modem chips would be able to = handle the=20 signal switching with less bounce, less noise and = ultimately without data loss. This technology = could be=20 available as early as 2013.

=20
UPDATE: From the = author, I=20 think there are bigger benefits than are being = seen. =20 Consider what this much throughput, over such a long = distance,=20 over one set of wires, means overall. At these = speeds,=20 12.5 GB/s per link, machines will be able to = communicate with=20 other machines and devices at speeds which are = impossible=20 today. I think the true potential here is that = the=20 benefits of having an ability to transmit so much = data, at=20 such long lengths, at such high speeds, using such a = simple=20 technology, will open the doors to countless new uses = that we=20 haven't even dreamed of yet. Technology will be = looked=20 at differently because there will be a new=20 baseline.

One of the biggest possibilities I = see is the=20 use of a central, secure machine. It will = transmit=20 multiple simultaneous streams of 1920 x 1440 video at = 85 Hz=20 using 32-bit color (940 MB/s), to allow remote = desktop=20 abilities on very simple portable devices. The = central=20 machine will run many virtualized OSes, and instances = of OSes,=20 allowing any authenticated end-user to flip back and = forth=20 through the machines as necessary on a very low-power, = low-performing portable device, while the big iron = desktop=20 machine does all the hard work in the = background. And=20 multiple users can be fetching back to the main = machine which=20 is running all of this simultaneously.

Each = user just=20 needs to carry around their simple tablet-PC like = device, the=20 one with almost no processing power, no real memory to = speak=20 of, only a very small, secure version of Linux to = handle=20 screen, mouse, keyboard, sound, etc., I/O. And = then, no=20 matter where the user goes in the home or office, hook = in to=20 that remote desktop ability and have an instantly = responsive=20 machine. No delays in painting the screen, even=20 full-framed 3D games can be streamed remotely. = Some kind=20 of receiver device could receive that full-framed = video data=20 and then simplify it for wireless transmission if the = need was=20 required.

I personally believe the idea of = having a=20 secure machine, one which can be running and hosting = however=20 many virtual OSes are needed, running whatever kind of = anti-virus software, etc., and then providing the = remote=20 ability to flip between them in real-time, is=20 significant.

I see the 100 Gbps as another one = of these=20 amazing tools which are coming our way in the next few = years. It will join the ranks of Terascale-like=20 processing, low-ower Moorestown-like platforms--which = are=20 basically MIDs with no tactile buttons where = everything is=20 touch-screen, WiMAX--which is = always-on/always-connected=20 broadband that goes with you no matter where you go, = fully=20 integrated 3D into the OS environment, etc. All = of these=20 wizz-bang features will be there. And 100 Gbps = ethernet=20 will simply be another one.

Subscribe to the TG Daily=20 Newsletter...and a chance to win a = Dell=20 Dimension XPS M1730.
See all giveaway = prizes! | Read the official = rules. Email:=20 =20

Comments (21) 3D"Add

cat 6=20 Nov 14, 2007=20 11:43

And=20 I'm just getting excited about networking my new home = with=20 Cat6 before the insulation goes in!!! Almost $300 for = 1,000 ft=20 of Belden wire...nice stuff though. Can't wait to = start=20 transfering some large files via the home network = (yes, I'm a=20 dork).

Toms: you should do a how-to on home=20 networking, ins/outs, uses, tools and technology to = build=20 something yourself and on the cheap (but not = comromising speed=20 and performance).

John = Doe

If = you had=20 gone to firefold.com you would have gott... = Nov 14, 2007 12:34 =

If you=20 had gone to firefold.com you would have gotten that = same spool=20 for $120. lol. I am in the same boat, I just wired my = basement=20 with 9 cat 6 leads and jacks. Now this, lol.

never = stops

Re: cat 6=20 Nov 14, 2007=20 12:38

Send=20 that stuff back and switch it for cheaper CAT5! I'll = refer you=20 to the smallnetbuilder article which says: =

"One thing=20 you shouldn't buy into, however, is any recommendation = that=20 tells you to use CAT6 for a gigabit Ethernet = installation...=20 Despite the fact that vendors would love to sell you = their=20 pricier CAT6 wares, you should only consider it if = you're=20 going to be running 10Gigabit Ethernet over copper, = which=20 frankly any small networker is going to be extremely = unlikely=20 to do!"

Here's the link to the whole article = (that=20 bit's on page 3)=20 =

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/24445/54/=20

ozyman

Re: Re: Cat=20 6 Nov 14, 2007=20 12:55

Who's=20 to say that is the future he or the next home owner = will not=20 be running 10 Gbps? He's not just running cable along = the=20 carpet or taped to the walls like I used to see in = some of my=20 friends' old college houses, but installing it in the = wall.=20 Once insulation and drywall go up (not to mention = texture and=20 paint), it's really messy (also expensive) to redo it. =

I know, I just ran a bunch of cable in my = basement=20 ceiling and then had cellulose blown in for accoustic=20 insulation. Then drywall, etc. I used Cat 5e just = because it=20 was not in my budget to go with anything faster. I = also used=20 Cat 5e for phone at each ethernet outlet. So in case I = would=20 have 1 bad cable for ethernet, I could just use that = for the=20 phone instead of pulling a new cable. Then there's the = RG6,=20 14ga speaker cable... and before you know it, there = goes a ton=20 of $$$.

John Doe, make sure to test your cable = before=20 your drywall goes up. The last thing you want = happening is=20 putting the connectors on after your house is done and = realizing you damaged a cable when pulling it through, = after=20 all the finish work is done.

Bob

If = only=20 ethernet speed were everything... Nov 14, 2007 12:57 =

I'd=20 love to see 100 Gbps. Unfortunately, I don't know of = any hard=20 drive that can write 100 Gbps, so most wouldn't see = anything=20 near this speed. SATA2 has a maximum transfer rate of = 3 Gbps,=20 with most drives seeing well less than that "ideal = rate"=20 (though the same will likely be said of this "100 = Gbps"=20 ethernet). I suppose, if I could have a ridiculou 34 = hard=20 drive RAID 0 setup (assuming little/no overhead or = processing=20 time) I could WRITE 100 Gbps worth of data. Otherwise, = it's=20 time for some big breakthroughs in storage tech before = its=20 worth the effort to even consider 100 Gbps tech for = most=20 folks.

What's the throughput for most of the=20 enterprise-grade storage systems? I think the max SCSI = speed=20 (Ultra-640 SCSI) is near 5.2 Gbps (~640 MB/s). How do = some of=20 the supercomputers handle moving and storing extreme = amounts=20 of data? Fibre channel huge RAID setups?

[This = level=20 of data transfer would open up entirely new = possibilities for=20 computer use models. The systems could transfer data = back and=20 forth between physical machines at rates exceeding = many=20 system's internal memory architecture read/write = abilities=20 today. The computers of tomorrow would be able to be = clustered=20 using high-speed data transfers, even for remote = thread=20 execution in very-near-to-real-time models. This kind = of=20 technology would be amazing. -Rick]

NeedFasterHDs

Fiber Optics=20 is a better solution Nov=20 14, 2007 14:11

I=20 agree its more expensive now, but with a little more = research=20 and manufacturing capacity, it'd be a much better = solution=20 than Cat-7.

Allen

Now to=20 integrate SLI/Crossfire over ethernet Nov 14, 2007 14:34 =

At 100=20 gbs per second, you'd almost be able to link video = cards and=20 send the data back and forth (Which is traditionally = done on=20 the PCIe bus/SLI cable).
It would be a whole new = twist to=20 using linked video cards :)

100GB with=20 sata Nov 14, 2007 = 14:35

Actually your = calculations for=20 34 hard drives are FLAWED..
typical SATA drives = are at the=20 60-70MB second. (theoritacal) so you would need over = 166 Hard=20 drives, in a striped array, just to get the = theoritacal 10GB=20 per second which is 100Gbps.
So yah, getting = 100Gps on a=20 LAN is just technically not feasable.
That also = =3D 77 15k=20 SAS drives in a striped Raid0 Array to get to that = limit.=20

rippleyaliens

Why=20 Nov 14, 2007=20 16:38

I=20 don't understand. Motherboards, NAS's have had 1Gb for = a=20 while. But consumer routers are just finally starting = to use=20 1Gb. (Unless you like buying a separate switch, which = have had=20 it for a while also.) How long until NICs, = mobos(onbard), NASs=20 have 100 Gb??? A LONG LONG TIME. 5e is cheap and will = not be=20 obsolete anytime soon. By the time you get 10Gb = hardware cat6=20 will be much cheaper, maybe 7 also. Much easier to = rewire each=20 few years and save a lot of cash IMHO. =

Rewiring isn't=20 too hard if you install PVC conduit in your walls = instead of=20 just stringing the wires. Upfront costs of the conduit = and a=20 fishtape will more than pay for themselves over time. = And the=20 day may come when you want to string fiber.

My = 2=20 cents.

Ummm

Spend the=20 money on wire (but don't overspend) Nov 14, 2007 16:41 =

I ran=20 2 RG6 and 1 CAT6 to every room in my house while it = was being=20 built, and am glad (RG6 is for satellite). I was = tempted to=20 run a "speedwrap" bundle = (http://www.smarthome.com/8683.html),=20 but it was mega expensive.

I also ran a bunch = of=20 12-gauge speaker wire in many rooms "just in case" I = wanted=20 speakers in there :)

glen

Re:Rick=20 Nov 14, 2007=20 16:52

quote:=20
[This level of data transfer would open up = entirely new=20 possibilities for computer use models. The systems = could=20 transfer data back and forth between physical machines = at=20 rates exceeding many system's internal memory = architecture=20 read/write abilities today. The computers of tomorrow = would be=20 able to be clustered using high-speed data transfers, = even for=20 remote thread execution in very-near-to-real-time = models. This=20 kind of technology would be amazing. -Rick] =

Don't=20 mistake throughput for latency. You may have an = amazing=20 throughput but bad latency (pipeline) and vice versa. = You know=20 what's happening with DDR2/3/4 memories, they have = faster=20 transfer rates but their CAS latency [in seconds] is = stuck at=20 the same value (2-2.5 cycles equivalent of DDR1).=20

[We've recently seen DDR2-800 memory that had = a CL3=20 latency. Also, as I'm sure you know, for computers, = the L1, L2=20 and L3 caches are designed to hide much of that = latency.=20 -Rick]

Prefetch and caching sure diminish the = problem=20 but i doubt that these techniques would be effective = for=20 cluster computing.

[My thinking is that with=20 point-to-point protocols between machines, it wouldn't = be an=20 issue. The lines would always be open, and the need = for=20 signicant signal routing or stack processing overhead = would=20 not be required. In fact, it would be so = counter-productive in=20 a point-to-point system that it would have to be = stripped.=20 -Rick]

No doubt, there is a lot of work to be = done on=20 network protocol stack and hardware to reduce the = latencies.=20 Otherwise, you just have a great medium for multimedia = content=20 (HD TV etc.).

[I should read all the way = through what=20 you write before I respond. As I continue through your = post I=20 see we're totally on the same page. -Rick]

The=20 Preacher

I = think it=20 will be a while before practical compute... = Nov 14, 2007 19:09 =

I=20 think it will be a while before practical computers = will be=20 able to actually communicate at even 1GB/sec. Too many = bottlenecks in the computer itself. An infrastructure = with it=20 would hopefully increase bandwidth for ISPs though, = hopefully=20 making 40-50MB/s connections from your ISP at a = reasonable=20 price.

Mike

In = my=20 experience... Nov = 14, 2007=20 19:19

I'm=20 currently working with a Bioinformatics shop, and we = just=20 recently designed and built a storage cluster around = the=20 Infiniband infrastructure. 4x Infiniband DDR runs at = 20Gbps=20 full duplex over a proprietary copper interconnect, so = we=20 actually aren't too far off from 100Gbps already. I = have no=20 trouble seeing both that this tech is possible fairly = soon,=20 and affordable not too long after. Also, when you = start to get=20 into the HPC (High performance Computing) side of = things, you=20 need extremely high speed interconnects (yes i mean=20 throughput, not latency :) ) just to prevent = bottlenecking on=20 your massive 64 node, 512 (or higher) processor = systems, all=20 of which are clustered together in such a way that the = combined disk speed easily exceeds your interconnect=20 throughput. There are a couple white papers out there = on some=20 blade clusters that describe 500gbps - 1Tbps WRITE = speed to=20 disk, so don't think this tech will be unnessary. =

Sohjinn

Future=20 proofing Nov 14, = 2007=20 20:00

The=20 only viable way (but not cheap) to protect yourself = from=20 outdated network cabling, is to have it run in pipe = and/or=20 flexible conduit. When the next great technological = wonder=20 comes around, just yank out the old cable & pull = in the=20 new stuff. Since low-voltage wiring isn't a fire = hazard, you=20 can use practically any kind of pipe you want, from = EMT to=20 cheap sprinkler PVC. Just don't go any smaller than = 3/4" pipe,=20 or you'll have a hard time pulling it without damage,=20 especially through bends. Ask your local electrician!=20

I agree on the CAT5e/CAT6 argument. It's = unfortunate,=20 but for all practical purposes CAT6 is no better than = the=20 1000' roll of CAT5e non-plenum for $75 at Home Depot. = Splurge=20 on the labor and level of expertise. The routing and=20 terminations of your wire will have a much more = profound=20 affect on the performance of your network than the = wire=20 itself.

Sparky

rebturtle

This=20 technology would be better served for ISP's or...=20 Nov 14, 2007=20 20:05

This=20 technology would be better served for ISP's or anybody = using=20 switches and routers. You could run less cable. For = instance,=20 I have a VOD server at work that has 16 cat6 = connections. That=20 would be an ideal solution for multiple IP transports. =

David

Also...=20 Nov 14, 2007=20 20:13

I=20 recently read an article about a new algorithm = developed to=20 reduce crosstalk/interference on DSL lines, producing = huge (on=20 the order of about 10x) speed gains. I don't see why = that=20 can't also be applied to this to effect the same = thing, as the=20 alrgorithm (if i remember right) had nothing to do = with DSL so=20 much as it improved transmission efficiency.

Sohjinn

I = don't know=20 who Ozyman is but... Nov=20 14, 2007 21:52

I back=20 him on what he said. 5e is great. 6 is unnecessary. = One thing=20 you guys might want to do when wiring a house is to = use some=20 small PVC tubing and run the wire through that. That = way if=20 you ever want to upgrade your wiring or add wiring, = you can=20 use the existing cable to pull other cables right = through the=20 piping.

JohnDoe

Hellooooo,=20 Fusion io? The ioDrive? Remember? Nov 14, 2007 23:53 =

I am=20 so amazed that no one mentioned the possibility of a = Fusion=20 ioDrive raid setup? This things is real and on the = market and=20 TG Daily reported on it not to long ago. It already = gets a 700=20 MBps transfer rate.

Rick - I love your = personal=20 comments about the possibilities of a central main = server and=20 inexpensive slave pcs. I use a $250 laptop I got on = ebay all=20 the time to tap into my better one via remote desktop. = I think=20 your predictions are right on about computing be that = way.=20

Not to long I was using my Ipaq 2100 to = terminal=20 service into my more powerful computer. With the new=20 android/linux/java platform coming we may have some = really=20 sweet low power apps to run locally on these slave = "screens"=20 as well.

By the time the 100 Gbps network is = ready,=20 the processor market will have grown again and = multi-core=20 computing in the teens or higher will be commonplace. = The=20 ioDrive will also have matured and it will be much = much=20 cheaper than $35/GB.

These devices will also = be able=20 to contain one of these bad boys -->=20
http://www.microvision.com/

Imagine = streaming high=20 def over your cell phone and onto your = wall....Anywhere within=20 network range.

I also think we have not seen = the last=20 of the resolution landscape...

Well - Overall = Rick, i=20 like your commentary, its ideas like that that make it = exciting. The possibilities...

Elijah

Hellooooo,=20 Fusion io? The ioDrive? Remember? Nov 14, 2007 23:54 =

Elijah

Cat6 is=20 usually unnecessary... Nov=20 15, 2007 08:12

By and=20 large, I agree that Cat6 is unnecessary for Gb = networks; I=20 have a Gb network at home with nothing but Cat5e, and = it has=20 excellent throughput, but there are a few instances = where it=20 is needed. Cat6 is shielded twisted pair, as opposed = to=20 Cat5/5e being unshielded twisted pair, thus 5/5e is = more=20 susceptible than Cat6 to interference from outside = sources. I=20 think we can all agree that ideally, we should not = wire=20 cat5/5e anywhere near power lines if we can help it = (and to=20 some extent, extreme close proximity with phone = lines--I've=20 had instances where the -90V from a phone call ring = can cause=20 "hiccups" in the affected network segment), but = sometimes=20 there are circumstances where that's the only option. = Also, in=20 some old houses, and in areas with high power = concentration,=20 you can have areas that are high in EMF radiation, = which can=20 potentially affect your network. In those cases, I = would=20 suggest the consideration of Cat6.

Mark

DSL=20 application Nov = 15, 2007=20 09:33

i=20 think, the technology would benefit DSL and farther=20 applications, not only around 100 meters.
By the = time they=20 could get this to work, fiber optic would be more = effective=20 then, eventually cheaper in the long run.

adrian

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